317 replies to this topic

[nitemarez]

that's great that you play with friends only and I respect your perspectives on the subject

but some of us still want the chance to play for rank competitively, but currently a great many cheaters ruin this and we have been informed that in order to effectively ban these less savory individuals from recreating infinite logins, etc we must vote to have serial validation re-instated.

also you can buy first decade brand new @ amazon for less than 20$ which includes serials for a number of cnc titles, you may even be able to purchase them here @ s-t for less now.

you see the cheaters win with the current systems in place because nothing can be done to stop them.

this is my stance and will remain so until we find a better more viable solution for everyone

[silver23]

yah go to amazon, I bought TS for about 5 dollars from there before haha

[Dyson]

Currently $8.80, I'll be purchasing
Thanks!
http://www.amazon.com/Command-Conquer-Tiberian-Sun-Pc/dp/B00000DMA8

[nitemarez]

well you want to be careful not to purchase "used" as the serial may be already in use or banned silver.

aleatory good find, and that's a perfect example!~

Edited by nitemarez, 10 February 2011 - 06:57 PM.

[silver23]

nah it was brand new, bought it about a few years back still works like a charm...but yes you brought up a good point, definitly becareful not to buy it used

[Olaf]

Currently $8.80, I'll be purchasing
Thanks!
http://www.amazon.com/Command-Conquer-Tiberian-Sun-Pc/dp/B00000DMA8

79 used from $0.01

[hefeweize]

that's great that you play with friends only and I respect your perspectives on the subject

but some of us still want the chance to play for rank competitively, but currently a great many cheaters ruin this and we have been informed that in order to effectively ban these less savory individuals from recreating infinite logins, etc we must vote to have serial validation re-instated.

also you can buy first decade brand new @ amazon for less than 20$ which includes serials for a number of cnc titles, you may even be able to purchase them here @ s-t for less now.

I think there is no longer infinite logins.. Well not attainable easily. you have to register on CP now. Any1 can make unlimited logins just buy purchasing more serials and making seperate st accounts. So things can be avoided.

Also, what do you think about this idea. Serial validation turned on, freeware TS will not be allowed to have thier points counted on clanners and turnies. This way both people can play online, and people who enjoy the competive ladder aspect (whom has freeware) will have to pay a small fee to olaf to "UNLOCK THIER PROFILE" for turny usage.

What u think Olaf>?

Basically, if you turn on serial validation and freeware no longer can go online, you just killed many potential and current players. THere is no way in the world that someone who has never played tiberian sun (10years old) will pay even .40 cents to try it out. If its free, they will download and give it a try. There is many people who is using the downloaded free version inlcuding me. If validation gets turned on, there will be many of us stuck in the streets w/o shelters. I dont mind paying tho. Just saying.

Edited by hefeweize, 11 February 2011 - 01:20 AM.

[Rico_wckd_jstr]

that's great that you play with friends only and I respect your perspectives on the subject

but some of us still want the chance to play for rank competitively, but currently a great many cheaters ruin this and we have been informed that in order to effectively ban these less savory individuals from recreating infinite logins, etc we must vote to have serial validation re-instated.

also you can buy first decade brand new @ amazon for less than 20$ which includes serials for a number of cnc titles, you may even be able to purchase them here @ s-t for less now.

you see the cheaters win with the current systems in place because nothing can be done to stop them.

this is my stance and will remain so until we find a better more viable solution for everyone

Yes but your way stops other from playing (rather selfish IMO) where as mine doesn't, yes it means some idiots are around but you can never stop them and you can take precautions to solve that issue, not being able to play at all is a game killer there and then.
As stated by hef above, locking out freeware is more of a disadvantage than advantage, and at the end of the day since EA gave the game out for free I don't agree that people should be forced to pay $ (any price) for a game that has been released for free with MP included.
Is it possible to have 2 servers (since TS has different server lists), one for free version that has no ladder board and one with ladder that requires a key? That'd solve the issue for both, it'd be very selfish to punish those that just wanna play a game with mates.

[Olaf]

What u think Olaf>?

I think I've already said we could require serials for tournament games.

[hefeweize]

I think I've already said we could require serials for tournament games.

Yes u did. But I'm saying if serial validation is turned on, would u b able to still make freeware players be able to play online. You can also implement CP to have a unlock tournament feature for $100 dollars so they are able to have their account obtain points.

I would not mind validation as long as we don't effect current population and the benefit of freeware online.

[Skable]

$100 really? I think that's a bit steep.

[Olaf]

Yes u did. But I'm saying if serial validation is turned on, would u b able to still make freeware players be able to play online.

That's implied, otherwise it wouldn't be requiring serials for just tournament games.

[WhiteTib]

http://xwis.net/forums/index.php/topic/162023-olaf-a-proposal-too-ea/

no need for serial validation then.


PS.. have it token based.

[nitemarez]

define a "token" for us all plz, even I dunno what you are saying.

[WhiteTib]

define a "token" for us all plz, even I dunno what you are saying.

Simply put... it's a way of banning people WITHOUT needing serial validation, but DOES require players to run an anti-cheat.

Olaf will know what I mean, and if he doesn't, it proves he hasn't read my post on how to build an anti-cheat for TS, and the 4 authentication methods used to ban cheaters.

[Olaf]

Simply put... it's a way of banning people WITHOUT needing serial validation, but DOES require players to run an anti-cheat.

Olaf will know what I mean, and if he doesn't, it proves he hasn't read my post on how to build an anti-cheat for TS, and the 4 authentication methods used to ban cheaters.

Have you build an 'anti-cheat' yet?

[nitemarez]

thank you for the explanation~

[Olaf]

thank you for the explanation~

That doesn't contribute anything to the discussion.

[WhiteTib]

Have you build an 'anti-cheat' yet?

YOU have server-side access
YOU have the trust of people here
YOU are the accomplished programmer at ST.

It's NOT that hard to create a .dll or .so to hook into the TS server, or even hardcode it.
Players would then have to install, and run the AC client check itself for crc errors (to prevent hacked clients) and then scan memory, and run as a T.S.R. create a token, and send the token to the server when the player logs in.

The player can then be identified by:
- player name
- player AC-id
- AC token
- ipv4 address
- ipv6 address
- TS serial number (when re-activated).

ALL identifying details will be sent from AC to Server, and held in an SQL db, and ban list linked to the db.

That's 5 different ways to individualy identify 1 player.
The T.S.R. then hooks TS, and checks for rogue pokes and freezes in hexcode in the memory, and titles of programs loaded into memory, and informs everyone that they are running a cheat (when detected), bans their 5 identifiers, and logs ALL info to the server, of the hack used, player identifiers, date / time, etc...


Have I built an AC before ? No, but I was involved heavily in coding 2 seperate anti-cheats for other games.. if you wish further details Olaf, feel free to pm me.


Relevance... ? Yes, it's very relevant.... because it helps prevent cheating, and bans hackers, just like the Serial Validation would.





PS... Hard drive scanning for cheat program names, is illegal in Germany, and can not be implemented, due to privacy laws.

Edited by WhiteTib, 12 February 2011 - 05:33 PM.

[Olaf]

It's NOT that hard to create a .dll or .so to hook into the TS server, or even hardcode it.

Have I built an AC before ? No, but I was involved heavily in coding 2 seperate anti-cheats for other games.. if you wish further details Olaf, feel free to pm me.

The server side part is not the problem.
I don't PM, but feel free to open a topic to discuss your AC.

[WhiteTib]

The server side part is not the problem.
I don't PM, but feel free to open a topic to discuss your AC.

And I don't talk about other games on a TS forum.... I like to make sure Bettz stays here, and doesn't follow me elsewhere.

[Farang]

WhiteTib couldn't code his way out of a wet paper bag.
He is all talk, no action.

[Dyson]

WhiteTib couldn't code his way out of a wet paper bag.
He is all talk, no action.

This is non-helpful to the topic; please refrain. Thank you


@WhiteTib I think the issue would come when trying to force the third-party (Anti-Cheat) application onto the entire community. Not only would it be a learning curve but, most users probably be hesitant in running an additional background process. I personally believe XWIS should avoid requirements of any external applications for game play.

[Farang]

This is non-helpful to the topic; please refrain. Thank you


@WhiteTib I think the issue would come when trying to force the third-party (Anti-Cheat) application onto the entire community. Not only would it be a learning curve but, most users probably be hesitant in running an additional background process. I personally believe XWIS should avoid requirements of any external applications for game play.

Non helpful in your opinion?
Also, you are a not a forum moderator, so i suggest you refrain from telling other users what is and isnt helpful.

This idea of an anti has been proposed many times before by WT, but the guy isnt capable of delivering, so its pointless discussing it, kapish?

[WhiteTib]

This is non-helpful to the topic; please refrain. Thank you


@WhiteTib I think the issue would come when trying to force the third-party (Anti-Cheat) application onto the entire community. Not only would it be a learning curve but, most users probably be hesitant in running an additional background process. I personally believe XWIS should avoid requirements of any external applications for game play.

Not particularly, you wouldn't have to "force" it... people are screaming out for banning cheaters for yours... and ANYTHING that makes the process of spotting cheaters, and banning them, fully automated... WITH authentication.... is something that the TS community will welcome.

I can imagine it now.


Topic: Here it is, what you have all been waiting for.... the official Strike-Team TS AC (url here)
Replies...
1. wooohooo
2. YAY
3. excellent


Other ways to introduce to include it are...
Pack it into the TS installer, and have a key to run it in the autostart section of the registry, or start folder of the menu... have a splash screen run to announce you are running it, so that people are aware.,,, or installer screens to let you know that you are installing the TSAC, etc...

When loading into the lobby.... the motd could announce something like...
"Welcome to XWIS, the TSAC has been released, you may still play TS without the TSAC, but other players will be aware you don't have it installed, and your chances of playing a game, will be very limited."

or

"Welcome to XWIS, the TSAC has been released, You will have to install it, to play other players using the Anticheat. You can download it from... http://www.downloadithere.com/tsac"


This is a very resourceful community, full of people, with zillions of ideas, and I'm sure they could think of other ideas.